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The Tao~Tai Chi and Chess

PostPosted: Mon Feb 13, 2006 7:50 pm
by Pamela
Hello everyone,

I wonder if there are any chess avids out there...

I have been pondering Chess, and its origins from the tao, as Taichi originates from the same foundation.

I have some theories, thoughts, and was wondering if anyone had any thoughts to add to my murky mix,

Off the cuff I might deduce that the king and queen would be the original Yin Yang combination.

The king~the original yin~ central equilibrium~constantly guarded and preserved?
The Queen~the original Yang~as the axle, maybe, Movement (counterparty to king)

I was thinking, the bishop, horse and rook as the offspring of the yin/yang...the arms...(one straight, one curved, one a mix~the trio)...I realize trigrams are made from two/emptyfull...but,
just trying to figure this out Image

Together this group produces the 64 possibility?...then the girth of execution of the added board produces that unlimited quantity?

Any feedback on these ideas would be appreciated,

as well as any thoughts on Pawns....

Thanks for bearing with me Image
I look forward to any feedback anyone might have to share.

Thank you,

[This message has been edited by Pamela (edited 02-13-2006).]

PostPosted: Wed Feb 15, 2006 8:13 pm
by Ten

[This message has been edited by Ten (edited 02-15-2006).]

PostPosted: Wed Feb 15, 2006 8:16 pm
by Ten
Hi Pamela,

I am new here, but I know exactly what you speak of.

Although I would have to say that, {in regards to pawns} the relation would be the transformation of the 64 hexagrams into everything else..this would be the reason of action, in that two universes are colliding with intent.

However, do you think there is a state of wuji in chess?

If your interested in exchanging views and theroies,..

Email me at

I am a administrator on a private forum where there is the main focus on discussion of daoist philosophy and principal theroy.

BTW, My father{R.I.P.} taught me how to play chess from a very young age.
It is my favorite game.

Hope to here back from you

Best Regards,

[This message has been edited by Ten (edited 02-15-2006).]

PostPosted: Wed Feb 15, 2006 9:17 pm
by Pamela
Hello Ten,

Thank you for addressing my query, I appreciate your input.

I will have to ponder what you say about pawns...I'm not sure I understand what you mean...

Wuji~no mind? I would say no, chess does not. In fact I was discussing that a couple days ago...I think Chess is strategy of mind, TaiChi, strategy beyond mind...( I am still using mine to do TaiChi...but hope one day to surpass that). ....I don't know, do you think Kasparov goes beyond mind? Image ...but my thoughts are not set in stone...

Thank you for your E~Mail, I look forward to visiting your forum.

Best wishes,

PostPosted: Wed Feb 15, 2006 11:20 pm
by Ten

[This message has been edited by Ten (edited 02-15-2006).]

PostPosted: Wed Feb 15, 2006 11:20 pm
by Ten
Could you send me another Email address Please?

The one you sent me does not work.
Mailer Daemon sent me back my responce to you.

thank you for your understanding


PostPosted: Wed Feb 15, 2006 11:37 pm
by Ten
I fixed it,..never mind

PostPosted: Mon Feb 27, 2006 1:54 am
by Audi
Hi Pamela:

<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">I was thinking, the bishop, horse and rook as the offspring of the yin/yang...the arms...(one straight, one curved, one a mix~the trio)</font>

Interesting thought. I had never thought of the knight as a combination of rook and bishop.

<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">I realize trigrams are made from two/emptyfull</font>

Is "empty/full" the same as "yin/yang"? I did not realize the terms "empty/full" were applied to the hexagram lines.

When I first glanced at your post, I was surprised that you analyzed the five different types of pieces, rather than the eight actual pieces that begin the game on the first rank. In other words, where you decided to look at the qualities of the "bishop," my mind immediately considered the queen-side bishop and the king-side bishop as potentially different. I was thinking in terms of matching the eight pieces to the eight diagrams (bagua).

Perhaps you could also match each of the 64 squares on the chess board to one of the hexagrams. Each square does tend to play a consistently different role in the game.

Your post also reminded me of speculations I have recently had about the game of Go (weiqi or wei ch'i). I have been reading up on it and experimenting a little and have been rather amazed at how many of its concepts seem to match up with what I think of as Yin/Yang theory.

The basic rules of Go are quite simple. The object of the game is to surround and control territory. The territory is both the object of how you place your stones (Go playing pieces are called "stones."), but it is also what allows your stones to survive. Dynamic balance is everything.

The game does not seem to have been designed to reflect Chinese philosophy on purpose, but many of the concepts reflect it anyway. Subtle duality is everywhere. "Thick" and "light" are good qualities for play. "Heavy" and "thin" are bad. The difference between these pairs is quite subtle, at least to beginners like me.

Go stones do not move, but many approaches to the game focus on movement imagery. Stones make "jumps," and groups of stones can "escape into the center." Bulky groups of stones are "unwieldy." Good shapes are "flexible."

A territory is only stable if within it, it has the potential for at least two separate "eyes" of territory. A territory with only one source of support--i.e., one "eye"--is doomed to capture.

Go is usually played on a grid of 19 by 19 undifferentiated intersecting lines. There is no hint of a multiple of 2, 8, or 64. And yet, the board can easily be analyzed according to 8 regions: the 4 corners and the 4 sides. The center is arguably, however, a distinct region with its own properties.

Each stone is the same as any other stone, but through its position, it can be the key to a game. In other words, stones display configurational power (i.e., shi4).

Stones draw power from their neighbors, and connections are supremely important. Unconnected stones are vulnerable and weak, but mere quantity does not confer the best power.

The death star ("ponnuki" in Japanese and "kai hua" ("open flower") in Chinese ) draws its power from its empty center, and the way it is formed, not merely from its external shape.

If you really want to have fun with Yin and Yang, try studying Go.

Take care,

PostPosted: Tue Feb 28, 2006 3:51 pm
by Pamela
Hi Audi,

Thanks for your thoughts.

This game of Go sounds interesting, a good strategy game...I will look it up.
Do you know if there are any shareware demos on the net for that, where I might be able to learn from and play against a computer opponent?...Where did you come across the game?

I think a novice chess player might approach the eight energies head on for each character~...but, being familiar with the game...I can't really see it that way.
The biggest questions for me are the squares and the pawns...which I am now pondering with the suggestions both you and Ten have offered.

Yin/Yang...empty/full Image No? Image lol....sigh....I am curious at your mention...I see it as the same thing...but maybe I am only looking with one eye. Image Any elaborations would be quite welcome.

Take care,

PostPosted: Tue Feb 28, 2006 4:09 pm
by Pamela
Hi again Audi,

Looking at my post...I thought I might clarify my last comment...

It is funny that you mention this context...just yesterday I was telling a friend that my experimentations with certain meditations and visualizations have led me to feel/see/become aware of my minds trajectories? through my left is straight and right set at an angle... Image

Your mention made me think of this.

Best wishes,

[This message has been edited by Pamela (edited 02-28-2006).]